Please can someone help me, I need to explain to my children about why we don't watch Lord of the rings and Harry Potter, I've tried but my son of 10 is continually telling its just a book/movie and not real.

Please Help
Thanks
Venessa

Venessa,

I will Pray that the Lord would intervene and open your sons heart to the truth. That he will grow to know what is good for him. May the Lord also put a hedge of angels around him for protection against the evil.

I have gone to pray over this same subject with my nephews, that can't get away from movies like that. I have encourage them to watch things that our good for them. They listen to me with their head and not their heart. Their parents let them watch anything. I took my concerns to The Lord and asked him for his guidance.

I have been taking my nephews to Church and trying to show them importantance of wants real.

I'm praying that the Lord reveals the truth to their Parents and for their salvation.


We will pray in faith against all schemes of the Evil that come against our young ones.

John Trevino

[This message was edited by JOHN TREVINO on January 20, 2003 at 07:46 AM.]

Hello Venessa,

You have asked a question that child phychologists, parent authors, and just plain parents have spent a life time talking about. In reality, the answer is very simple to answer, but somewhat more difficult in our modern sin-riddled society to carry out. I am not a psychologist or an author, but I am a parent (probably the most important job on the list, wouldn't you say?) So here is my attempt to help.

Just as the Lord puts limits on us, His children, we as parents are to put limits on our own children. My wife and I have always tried to carry out our parenting in an attempt to "work ourselves out of a job". Yours and our goal is to produce responsible adults who are able to function independently of parental authority, yet wholly submitted to God's desires for us.

I like this scripture: Proverbs 22:6: " Train up a child in the way he should go, and when he is old, he will not depart from it."

To that end, we have tried to glorify the Lord in all that we do in our home. Consistency is the key here. We do not watch television or movies that we do not want them to watch. We try to conform our behavior to what we want our kids to immitate, although I do fall down terribly on this at times!

The goal here is to help our children to internalize certain limits for themselves. There will come a time when mom and dad won't be around to set up boundries.

When one of our children questions me on a decision, I do not say "Because I said so !" It frustrates children to hear this. Instead, when questions like "Why can't we see this movie?" come up, we use the time to lay bricks to the foundation by "teaching them how they should go". At the same time, questions such as this give us an opportunity to pass along our faith in the Lord and our corresponding values. I have always felt that our children will never adopt our faith and values because we tell them to. I try to show them that what matters to us regarding values also works for us in making our lives better and conforms us to what God expects from us. Our kids must have no doubt that our faith in the Lord is sincerely a part of our life.

To that end, we sit down with our children and talk to them about what God wants for us. We read scripture and tell them how the scripture has helped us be better parents and grown-ups. I never resort to finger-pointing to those who do see Harry Potter type movies or many others where the Lord is desecrated in word and deed. Nor do we simply point to the Bible and say that we should do something because the Bible tells us "not to". We talk, read, and explain. We listen to the child too and allow them to tell their story. But, in the end, never back down or compromise on God's precepts either in their lives or your own.

Awhile back, I wrote down these scriptures, using a great website: www.christiananswers.net They have helped me as a father to keep our family on the correct moral course on matters of entertainment. I hope that you find them helpful too (the scripture is listed followed by a short summary of what is said in them) :

1 Thessalonians 5:21-22: Test everything. Hold on to the good. Avoid every kind of evil.

James 1:27: Keep oneself from being polluted by the world.

3 John 11: Do not imitate what is evil.

Romans 12:9 Abhor what is evil. Cling to what is good.

Deuteronomy 18:9-14 Do not learn to imitate detestible ways, including spiritists, sorcerers, and witchcraft.

Ephesians 5:11-12: Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness. Live as children of light.

1 Timothy 4:1: Do not follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.

1 Corinthians 10:21: You cannot have a part both at the Lords table and the table of the evil one.

2 Corinthians 6:14-17 What fellowship can light have with darkness?

1 Corinthians 11:1 Follow the example of Christ

1 Corinthians 10:31 Whatever you do, do everything for the glory of God

James 4:7-8 Submit yourselves to God. Resist the devil. Purify your hearts

Ezekiel 44:23 Teach my people to distingush between the unclean and the clean

Matthew 18:6 If anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for that person to be thrown into the sea

Hosea 4:6 My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge

John 3:19-20 People who are involved in evil hate the light of Christ because the light shines truth on their evil

Romans 13:12 Put aside the deeds of darkness and put on the armor of light

Ephesians 6:11-18 Take your stand against the devil's schemes

I hope this all helps you and your husband, Venessa. You will see, one day, that as your child begins to model his own likes and dislikes on these same values, your persistence will all have been worth it. God Bless You.

WOW! Awesome reply Nick!!

Thank you Nicky, this is really powerful. My son enjoys research, so I will make a mini project with him and look up the verse you have listed and I know this will help him and his sister and put things into perspective. it will also help him when facing pressure from friends and he will be able to answer for himself.

Thanks
God Bless
Venessa

Vanessa & Nick!!

First of all I pray that your son will consume the scriptures and the Awesome reply that Nick wrote.

IT is so important to respond to our request as the Holy Spirit Leads!!! We are all desciples and vessels of God's Word.

I beleive in my spirit it is important to listen to our Children when it comes to things like this. If we jump on our children about watching things that are not real, they may rebell against us,just as I did when I was a kid. We need to explain the importance of want God has Designed for our homes as the place where His Word is to be taught, lived and passed on from generation to generation. Deuteronomy 6:6-7 says, "These commandments that I give today are to be our hearts. Impress them on your children. Talk about them when we sit at home, when walk along the road, when we lie down,and when we get up."

Like Nick said about Proverbs 22:6 " Train up a child in the way he should go, and we should walk there every once in a while yourself." As our children are being exposed to the way we handle things in our daily walk, they are noticing every attitude we convey and every word we say-and carefully imitating us. Can we honestly say to our children, without embarrassment," Follow my example, as I follow Christ"?(1 Corithians 11:1)

I also believe that we should teach our children to Thank God for His protection and goodness, to confess their sins to the Lord.

We have a stewardship with every child God gives us. Usually we have them in our homes for a short time before they leave and establish their own families. We need to pray that God will "teach us to number our days aright" (Psalm 90:12).

I pray while our time is limited, we must decide what we will and will not do to best bring up our children in "training and instuction of the Lord" (Ephesians 6:4) If we make it a priority to say and do those things that will teach your children life's most important lessons.

May the Lord guide us with wisdom and patience while our children grow with us in our Walk with the Lord!!!!


God Bless Your Family!!!!

John Trevino

Nick,
Thanks for the referral and link. I checked it out and put it in my favorites bookmark.

Thank you John, I have learnt so much in such a short time, and I know with all this Godly wisdom is will certainly make things so much easier,

God Bless
Venessa

Dear Venessa
I am getting into this conversation right at the tail end, but hope my input can be helpful too. I have had this very same question put to me by nieces, and also lately by some parents who sees the Harry Potter series as a wonderful example of the triumph of good over evil. Now how do you argue against that ? My thoughts are simple : 1.God created this earth and ALL it. 2.He tells us in his scripture that we shouldn't meddle with witchcraft and fortune tellers. 3.He also says that the air around us is filled with demons.
The Potter series go against all of the above: In the Harry Potter books, new things are 'made' by fictitious characters. Witchcraft are being used by both the 'good' and the 'bad' characters. Flying 'baddies' are portrayed in a way that is sometimes humorous.
So, the books cleverly desensitize us all to witchcraft by presenting the 'good' witches (harry potter and friends)as well as the bad witches. Once that's done, a channel has been created for the Demons in the air around us.
I have read in one of the papers here in the UK
that some of the 'fictitious' names of characters are actual, recognised names in the witches world. That scares me. It makes me turn to God and the Bible even more.
So if it was my child, I'd try and explain by saying that Jesus does not want anybody to go into clairvoyancy or the kind of magic created by witchcraft. Those people interfere in a spiritual realm where we should only rely on God, and pray not to be pestered by these demons. I unfortunately cannot quote and say where in the Bible is it written that wizardry and magical tricks and clairvoyancy and dealing with beings from the 'underworld' (aka certain of the Potter books with those beings that 'sucks the soul out of people'). I have read the first three books because I wanted to see for myself the depth of our predicament - I admit that it is easy to say that the books are only a lovely fantasy from a woman who is a mother herself and understands the imagination of children....BUT. Isn't there something scary in that itself? WHO is so powerful to reach MILLIONS of children - the precious little beings that belong to GOD, and taint their minds from a very young age? Man, we as christians are just not doing enough to try and stop this evil. I am in no way implying that the author is the Devil : he might just use her. I don't know.
I am the mother of a 6 month old baby. I want to protect this infant like you try and protect your children, but also raise them like Nick does his...I hope this answer helps. Sorry if it's a bit long-winded (English isn't my mother tongue).

Marlyn,
I agree with every word you've written, and it is expressed very well. Let's obey God's Word, and "touch not the unclean thing." Why put at risk our children so that, when Satan insinuates to them that witchcraft is "fun," they will be open to his leading?

Marlyn - This is also a very good reply. The issue of becoming desensitized to sin and demonic forces is an issue we should all pay more attention to. Unfortunately, I'm afraid the process of becoming desensitized even begins with some of my favorite Disney movies like Snow White, Cinderella, and Sleeping Beauty.

Dear Lord, I pray we do not become like the frog in a pot of water who will boil to death before it even knows the temperature has risen.

As a father of 4 - 17, 15, 13,and 6. I hear what you are saying. And I offer up my 2 cents worth.

The Bible says it is not what goes into a person that is evil, it is what comes out.

If you shield your children from the world you will only set them up for many hardships to come. My children have the same desires and wants as yours. I prayed and decided to take me children to the movie and watch it with them. Afterwards we were able to separate the fantasy from reality.

My children, wife and I are envolved in our church. I asked their youth ministers to address the issue during their Wednesday night meeting and keep the kids focused on God and stay mindful of the fact that entertainment is just that, entertaining. The Word of God must never be compromised. The only way to keep peer pressure and the world from taking over your children is to not be of the world, while yet in the world. They will be exposed to the very things you are trying to shield them from. I choice to expose them on my (and Gods) terms and have the opportunity to address the issue now instead of later or not at all.

Good to read your feelings on this topic, Allen. You seem to have handled it well within your family.
I do not agree, however, with you saying that according to the Bible it is not what goes into a person that is evil, but that which comes out.
That would mean that we could all watch blue movies (just and example), and as long as we do not do those things ourselves we'd be OK....
The Bible cautions us to be mindful of what we involve ourselves in and with, as not all things are good (Was it Paul who said that?)We are constantly beseeched to follow the narrow road, and not to give in to the world.
I do not say that you have been wrong in seeing the movie with your kids - I do not know how I would have handled it myself.
That's what I find so infuriating : not knowing how to handle this seemingly innocent issue of a mere storybook.....

I hope Allen logs into this topic again because I need to apologise to him:
I disagreed with you regarding '... what comes out of a person makes him evil... ', but since then realized that my argument was not founded in wisdom. You were quoting scripture and my interpretation was flawed. I have subsequently read that exact piece, and feel really bad. Sorry Allen.

Dear Marlyn and Allen

I myself have not been able to log on to the messsage board as often as I would like and today had a couple of minutes to spare and I noticed your views on the topic.

I thank you for them and I will certainly go through them again at home. I have discussed this at length with my son aged 10.5. Although he understands what God word is, he is still swayed by his friends and the whole fantasy of the movie. The first Harry Potter movie is currently been shown on one of the TV channels in S.A. We do not subscribe to that channel and I heard my son saying how sorry he was bec now he could not see the movie, to find out what it is all about. He is always taking out books from the library on magic and Sabrina etc. He now hides his books from me. What do I do!!!!!

After reading Allens views, I think maybe I should allow him to either read the book, watch the movie and then discuss it with and help him understanding God's principles on this.

The "forbidden fruit" is always so tempting isn't.

Thanks again for the views.
God Bless

Venessa

Venessa - This is a very difficult issue! As you continue to wrestle with this, I strongly encourage you to take the issue before God. We often rationalize our course of action while bypassing the fundamental council of asking God what He would have us do.

With respect to the advice that we allow our kids to experience the "bad" and then use the opportunity to teach why it's bad and God's call for good: Where are you planning to draw the line? Would you allow your son to look at a pornographic magazine and then simply discuss the issue with him? I know you wouldn't. I simply state the extreme to highlight how the enemy will always pressure us to compromise and move the boundary line closer and closer to evil.

Keep seeking God's direction.

Dear Venessa,

One of the challenges of being a parent these days, actually the challenge has been with parents since the beginning of time, is separating out our own wisdom from that of the Lord's. So often, what seems right to us, and to youth pastors and to pastors, deacons and whomever else is human may not be the enactment of Godly wisdom that we see in written form in God's word.

"It is not what goes into a person that matters, it is what comes out". while this statement may sound good and logical to us, taken in context with scripture references already noted, it is really a potentially flawed way of looking at wickedness. How far do we go with this? Is it necessary to expose our children to every potential sinful act possible in order to help them sort out the fact from fiction? Take it to it's extreme, as your son will likely do. How far so you let him experience life if order to teach him that God is a God of obedience and not logical thinking.

Children can and should be taught about the wickedness of sorcery, pre-marital sex, drugs, and alcohol, but it is not necessary nor wise to involve them in these activities to teach them they are simply wrong and will assist in separating them from God. This is not my philosophy or logic, but God's as bourne out in many scriptures, but this will do:

2 Corinthians 6

16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you.
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty

There is a Biblical principle; by beholding we become changed. That is why we are admonished to think on "whatsover is true, honest, just, pure, lovely, and of good report." The verse that settles the question for me is in Psalm 101:3, "I will set no wicked thing before mine eyes."

Dear Karin, Nicky and Steve

Thank you so much for your advice.

In our bible study at work this morning we read Phil 3 v 10-11. v10 I want to know Christ and the power of his resurrection and the fellowship of sharing in his sufferings, becoming like him in his death.

I am so thankful that I have this medium of sharing my "sufferings" with all of you and receiving Godly advice.

I have become tired of the continual nagging etc from my son, and have begun to think well maybe he must read the books, watch the movie etc and then maybe his curiosity will be kerbed. But as Steve mentioned that we allow the enemy to pressure us to compromised our beliefs and allow evil to come into our homes and minds etc.

I am so glad that I did hesitate before making a decision, and listened to the Holy Spirit and log on again to the message board.

It is sometimes so easy to think in "gray" instead of white or black - right and wrong and no compromise and in between.

We serve an awesome God.

God Bless you all
Venessa

I agree totally about the Harry Potter books. There is an excellent book available at Christian bookstores that explains what is wrong with H.P. in detail from a Christian perspective. The author also differentiates between HP and Lord of the Rings, however.

The Lord of the Rings trilogy was written by a Christian. In these books, evil is evil, good is good. It is true that "magic" is used but only sparingly by the good guys. To me it is more representative of the supernatural power of God. The theme of the books is still good overcoming evil, and the magical ring represents sin, which so easily takes ahold of all who touch it. These books contain many allegories to Christian beliefs. I watch the movies with my kids and we search for these meanings together. There is also a book called "Finding God in the Lord of the Rings," which I found helpful.

Harry Potter is quite different. The main character is disobedient, mischeivous, and arrogant. He fights evil with evil, not with good. The magic in these books is taken from a study of the occult and contains actual spells and rituals of satanists and witches, which still exist today, make no mistake.

The author of the HP books makes no claim to be a Christian, while J.R. Tolkein, author of the Lord of the Rings trilogy and The Hobbit was a dear friend of C.S. Lewis, who wrote "The Tales of Narnia", which are even more blatantly Christian. Tolkein affirmed Christ publicly and in his literature. I believe he is with our Lord this day.

I hope this is helpful for you.

Ardith,

First of all I want to welcome you to this message board. I pray that you always feel the love and safety of Christ through your fellow Christians here. I also am encouraged by your desire to reach others in New Age with the good news of Christ. I will pray that God uses you as tool to do just that.

hie there guys

Interesting Topic you started here,
I was more than glad to see all those awesome replies and advice. I am also new, and should say I am or a horror movie and all these sci-fi movies fanatic. I rarely watch drama or romantic comedies. Well its rather sad but I guess God had a purpose he directed me to this site and look at all those things i have learned. When it comes to Lord of the rings i have dedicated one of my bedroom walls to pictures and posters of the movie. I have copies of the movies at home which i beleive i have watched a million times with the same passion all the time, and I can say now i almost perfectly know the next word each actor is going to say.

Question? - To my horror I asked myself how many pictures of Jesus do I have in my Room? And the embarassing answer is "1" Imagin! now am I any different from idol worshipers I answer myself NO!

The only calming thought is at least someone "Ardith" thinks of the whole Lord of the rings issue from a christian perspecive and I am glad. But that is not a way of getting away with my foolishness.It hurts me so much now and I thank God for all these people who wrote about this issue on the message board to open my eyes. If I had so much love for God wouldnt I be a better christian? if i devote so much time to doing Gods work and watching the "prince of egypt and all christian movies" wouldnt I be a different person. I still Think the movie is cool. But I am looking at what has happened to me ever since.

I have been unfair to God and to myself. Its only fortunate that I have watched only two H.P. movies but not with the same passion But when it comes to Steven King and his Novels and Movies I wont say because I might make people scared I follow with a passion and can read a novel till the break of dawn.

My Question is Ruramai "why can't you do the same with the Bible?" I answer myself I was Blind but now I see. Today when I finish work and go home I am going to remove all those pictures on my wall and leave my jesus there.

I am going to pack away my novels and movies and leave my Bible there. Because this is the day that the Lord hath made i am going to rejoice and be glad in him.

I wish i could tell you all what has happened to my heart over the years.I have earned myself names like "cold heart" and all I have done cruel things maybe its my nature but I dont beleive our Loving father never meant for us to be bad or cold hearted.

I love God with all my heart and I guess this is all I needed to give me that final push to be right next to him. Thank you everyone. I have so much more to write and say but I cant right now because I am at work. I just feel this inner emotion welling up in me, Oh How I love the Lord and How so much I have been wrong. I know my father is a forgiving father and he will take me back into his loving arms.

Amen Amen Amen! Thank You Ardith Thank You Nick and Thank You Vanessa!

Love always Rhue

Rhue,

Rhue, God sure is growing you in some areas. Thank you for sharing that, because It will prompt me and others to look at those areas in our lives where we spend too much of our thought and emotion on other things rather than Jesus. There can be arguments either way concerning the Christian influence of the Lord of the Rings. I do know that it has been an inspiration to many concerning the Sacrifice of Jesus carrying the heavy burden of our sin. I was able to pull that out of the movie. It was obviously even more evident in the movie "The Passion". Another point to make is that there are certain things in life that don't become sin unless they take the place of God and are done in excess. Examples maybe hobbies, work etc. And that statement applies to everyone differently. That’s why a PERSONAL relationship with Jesus Christ is so import. We need to know what he wants us to do with our live individually not just wake up and check off boxes that make us feel like we are serving him. We need to constantly be willing to be molded and changed. He knows us better than we do and sometimes it’s hard to realize that. God's sacrifice and grace are the most amazing gifts He has given.

hie Shawn

Thanks for that reply, am still at work waiting for my mom, but I guess it is for a reason. I have time to view the message board and your response, thank you again for that message you pulled out of the Lord of the rings I will take Frodo as resembling that heavy burden of the cross. You can see he was tempted like Jesus but stood steadfast he would have yeilded the york that was so heavy but he, knew the fate of the world stood in his hands. The evil forces of the dark Lord Sauron would have destroyed him in this case Satan. Hey listen to me I am re telling the movie, which is not my point.

but I just wanted to stress out that what you said was true, when these things start taking Gods place whatever it is, you know even a person can take Gods place when we want, a person like a husband or wife a child or a friend. I guess the bottom line is what ever we fancy or like it should never take the love we have for God, the time we spend with him and all those other nice things we have going on with our Lord God.

Forgive me but I talk as much as I write. But I pray God will use that as a gift.
Thank you again Shawn I Know I am not whole yet but I pray that God continues to minister to me through this message board and I would also welcome any help from any brother or sister who wishes to help me grow spiritualy. All critisisim is also welcome. Please do pardon my english and my spellings.

God Bless you

Love Rhue

Rhue,

Amen, your in my prayers, thanks for the words.

Thanks guys for bringing this older post to the top again. The replies are great. Why should we entertain ourselves and our kids with things that are an abomination to God? My son learned what the word abomination meant when he was a tot. I heard a film maker say on tv that many things regarding Harry Potter are being posted on web sites and many of these sites gives direct links into actual witchcraft and pagan sites that flagrantly invite kids to learn about them.

I'm not sure if this has been brought up or not, but unlike harry potter which glorifies witchcraft as such, "the Lord of the Rings" was written by a christian trying to help young men returning from the front lines of the world wars to cope with the horrors that they saw, and help them to realize that good (GOD) WILL win the war with bad (satan) and that part of that war will be won by the little people (us) because of their faith. It was told in a fantasy manner in part to take a bit away from the realities they faced and to let them see that what they saw was horrible but not the whole picture. it's actually very complex and not really meant for children and I wouldn't suggest it for anyone under about 12 years old, but I would recommend it for anyone above that age, either the movie OR the books (the movie kept to the books in a remarkable way). I would NOT recommend harry potter to anyone. I know that trying to say there are good witches and bad is a BIG thing right now (charmed, buffy and angel....and that's just on TV) but the fact is that while the "wiccans" don't KNOW they worship satan, they ARE deceived into doing so, and while they don't cast spells "against" other people as the satanists do, it IS still witchcraft and therefore not acceptable to YHVH no matter if it's for "good" or "evil". YHVH bless - parenting is very hard work and getting harder all the time.
Kat

I have a lot to say, well here goes - First of all I think we all know that witchcraft is against God's word, but there is that part that was brought up that whatsoever goes into a man isn't what defiles him. Well a question to be raised is "Does that give us a licence to expose ourselves to bad influences?" Bad company corrupts good morals. JustMe reminded me of a sermon I heard from Lester Sumerall that had to do with the influences that we allow ourselves to pay attention to - he quoted Mk 4:24 "Take heed what ye hear" Lk 8:18 "Take heed therefore how ye hear" I thought there were a couple more in there but these are all I could remember, the message was about not exposing ourselves to bad influences "For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret." (Eph 5:12). I think it goes back to that individual relationship & personal covenant that I have been talking about for a while now.

As far as raising our children is concerned that is another good question, do we sheild them from the bad influence of the witchcraft in the movie or let them see it & explain to them that although we seem to be getting entertainment out of it, we must realize that witchcraft is against God's way. I don't know the answer for you but I let my kids see the movies after I told them a speil about how witches are evil all the time. I used to call myself a warlock & the way it was described to me is that they worship the one true God of the bible along with other gods (demons) besides. So it is really scary now that I have kids, I mean what if they get mislead by some wiccan because they confuse 'em by saying that we do the same god as your father so it's ok?

There is also another question that should be raised - Does God mind us when we create Christian-based fantasy (especially if it has pagan elements like magic)? (That reminds me of the question "Is it ok to celebrate Christmas as Jesus' birthday although it has pagen roots?") As it was pointed out Lord of the rings was by a "Christian" author but Gandolf/Mithrandir was a wizard & we should not suffer a witch to live; as it was pointed out by Kat on another thread.

On a side note they did change one big part of the book when they turned it into a movie, one of my favorite charecters wasn't in the movie - Thorin Oakensheild, leader of the Dwarfs & the war of 5 armies, one of the armies was a dwarven army & they didnt show up in the movie either.

Getting back to some of the points that was raised here - I mentioned before in another thread that I heard whatever you spend your time money & energy on is your god, so if your focus in life is fantasy (as mine has been during some years, I can relate to the posters on the wall bit because there was a time that I had wall to wall posters of comic book heroes on my walls) and you buy all the latest novels & you go to all the latest movies & you & all your freinds talk about it all the time & you buy little video games about it & you have little nick nacks with your favorite charecters on it then it seems like the fantasy is your god more than the one true God; but he is going to judge your heart, not me.

I know in my life personally God used something that most christians call demonic to save my life or the life of someone else; now the story is a bit long & I may tell it to you later but suffice it to say that God used Doungeons & Dragons to save me from killing myself or someone else.

I can't say that fantasy is always bad, it makes us think & use our brains & creativity, but it can be taken too far & the only thing that we are allowed to obsess on is God, if we obsess on anything else we are an idolator. I am sure that nobody who is here wants to be an idolator, nor do they want their children caught up in wicca.

These are hard questions that we are faced with, are we as christians allowed to get entertainment from something demonic? Like some television shows where people get killed - there is a ongoing theme out there - that the lines of good & evil aren't clear, like the premise of the Riddock movie - its evil vs evil, now I really want to see that movie, but is it going to glorify God?

There is a passage that says all things are lawful for me but not all things are expedient - I think that means that God's grace will allow me to do anything I want, but not everything I want will be benificial for me or anyone else. There is that one passage that says we should be redeeming the time - we should be making our time count for something - not nessisarily wasting it by indulging in a fantasy that will have no benifit to anyone -

Unless just by a small chance of a miricle there is a godly principle in the movie that we can bring to someone's rememberance while we are witnessing to them. Sometimes I do that, I will sing a secular song in the middle of a sermon because almost everyone I talk to has heard the secular song so they can identify - the last example of this is when I brought up the passage in Isa 30:15 to someone on the street I started singing the song that goes "relax, don't do it, when you want to get to it, relax, dont do it..." Just to say that some secular guy had a similar idea that was in the bible (maybe not but I got the point accross, I was talking about waiting to hear the voice of God & relax sounded like a good compliment to that thought). I personally don't get to use movies as often as songs.

I mean I never had to preach a sermon about the similarities between the lord of the rings & christianity, but God didn't give me that sermon, if he gave it to you then preach it every chance you get! I think there are a lot of important issues raised here & I have no concrete answers, I just know that our heavenly father loves us & wants to talk to us & if we listen then he will tell us how to deal with our children & the issue of fantasy.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Slade,

I was thinking about how much personal enjoyment I got out of Harry Potter & something occured to me - there is a perhaps subliminal message in the story that I don't like - although the star is mild mannerd, meek & oft-timed bullied, awkward young kid as I was growing up so I can identify with him, but what I can't identify with is the thought that there is not one single thing in the real world or outside world or non magical world that gives Harry Potter any joy, light, or comfort. And to top it off; people who don't belong to the magical world are called a name akin to a racial slur "muggles" & are treated as if they are all daft, incompetent, & untrustworthy. Mix that with what was said earlier that there are references to actual occult practices & names makes it quite scary to think that we are letting our kids watch it; because as many kids want to do they want to find a way to rebel, or if not fully rebel at least irritate their parents when children feel that they have been treated unfairly by adults due to strict rules or consequences or what have you. Just if the wrong door is opened in our child's life it is sometimes very hard to get it closed again without that child getting at least scarred.